"'Come now, let us reason together,' says the Lord." - Isaiah 1:18
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CTF Official Homosexuality Debate, A heterogenous discussion |
 Jan 13 2009, 05:27 PM
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#4501
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 Hilton Lover.  Group: Gentryman Posts: 2,790 Joined: 29-November 08 Member No.: 21,867 Gender : Male Name : Karen  |
QUOTE (alex28 @ Jan 11 2009, 07:16 AM)  obviously i'm biased towards what the bible says. if you don't believe in the bible than obviously nothing i said applies to you. I really was hoping that irony wasn't completely lost on you. If we, as homosexuals, are inherently biased concerning the issue, and therefore should not expect our opinions to count, the you, as a heterosexual, are also inherently biased and have no more credence for the acceptance of your opinion. |
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Jan 26 2009, 03:10 AM
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#4502
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 Catching On Group: Newcomer Posts: 4 Joined: 26-January 09 From: Melbourne, Australia Member No.: 22,792 Gender : Male Name : Ben |
This thread made me register and post.
Soviet sword, Matthew and Comeuppance: QUOTE What does the Bible say about homosexuality? There are those who like to say that the Bible does not condemn homosexuality. Various verses are cited (out of context) and the verses that people use to show that homosexuality is wrong are explained away. The world wants to change God's words and meanings into something more suitable to its sinful desires. Nevertheless, the truth stands: The Bible condemns homosexuality as a sin. Let's look at what it says. Lev. 18:22, "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination." Lev. 20:13, "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltness is upon them" 1 Cor. 6:9-10, "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God." Rom. 1:26-28, "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, 27and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. 28And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper." Homosexuality is clearly condemned by the Bible. It goes against the created order of God. He created Adam and then made a woman. This is what God has ordained and it is what is right. Unlike other sins, homosexuality has a severe judgment administered by God Himself. This judgment is simple: They are given over to their passions. That means that their hearts are allowed to be hardened by their sins (Romans 1:18ff). As a result, they can no longer see the error of what they are doing. Without an awareness of their sinfulness, there will be no repentance and trusting in Jesus. Without Jesus, they will have no forgiveness. Without forgiveness, there is no salvation. What should be the Christian's Response to the Homosexual? Just because someone is a homosexual does not mean that we cannot love him (or her) or pray for him (her). Homosexuality is a sin and like any other sin, it needs to be dealt with in the only way possible. It needs to be laid at the cross, repented of, and never done again. As a Christian, you should pray for the salvation of the homosexual the same you would any other person in sin. The homosexual is still made in the image of God -- even though he is in grave sin. Therefore, you should show him same dignity as anyone else you come in contact with. However, this does not mean that you are to approve of their sin. Don't compromise your witness for a socially acceptable opinion that is void of godliness. CARM.org |
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Jan 26 2009, 01:56 PM
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#4503
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 Holy Roller Group: Resident Posts: 656 Joined: 26-December 06 From: Florida Member No.: 9,430 Gender : Male Name : Matthew |
It always baffles me when people quote the same old Bible verses, as though I haven’t heard them before. XD How do they expect me to respond? “Oh my gosh! You mean the Bible says that!? D:” I hate to be so sarcastic, but seriously people it gets old...I’ve read it, numerous times, and most gay Christians have memorized those verses, so save your breath.
The ultimate refutation is simple: I am a Christian and I have been one all my life, yet just the same I started having homosexual attractions at a young age. I thoroughly, prayerfully, researched this topic trusting the Spirit of Truth to lead me, and having faith that God would not abandon me to deceptive spirits. I now believe that homosexuality is acceptable, and I have gained a great deal of understanding through my trials. I have witnessed the fruits of the Spirit in both my own life, and in the lives and ministries of other gay Christians. I love God more than ever, and I have a desire to spread God’s Word and further His Kingdom. So if you wish to tell me I’m wrong and deceived, and that the Scriptures actually condemn me, then you’re not only causing God to contradict Himself, but you’re also speaking blasphemies against His Spirit. My advice to everyone, so that you will not be sinning in ignorance, is simple: get to know Gay Christians before you judge them. This post has been edited by Matthew: Jan 26 2009, 01:57 PM |
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Jan 26 2009, 01:57 PM
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#4504
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 Voice of the people.  Group: Moderator Posts: 4,679 Joined: 24-August 07 From: Spencer, NY Member No.: 13,191 Gender : Male Name : Chad |
Maybe you guys didn't get it - debating homosexuality isn't allowed. That's not really to difficult to understand, is it?
</backseat modding> |
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Jan 26 2009, 01:57 PM
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#4505
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Holy Roller Group: Resident Posts: 656 Joined: 26-December 06 From: Florida Member No.: 9,430 Gender : Male Name : Matthew |
QUOTE Maybe you guys didn't get it - debating homosexuality isn't allowed. That's not really to difficult to understand, is it? </backseat modding> It's also against the rules to discriminate against different denominations and doctrines of Christianity, but somehow it always slides with respects to homosexuality; people are allowed to speak out against it all they wish, and yet it seems the one who objects is singled out as the rule-breaker. I’m sorry, but I won’t stand idly by and let what is good be spoken of as evil, and I will give a reason for the hope that is within me, and stand up for my GLBT brothers and sisters if someone speaks disparagingly about them. I can’t be held culpable for negligence in not enforcing the rules to begin with. This post has been edited by Matthew: Jan 26 2009, 02:29 PM |
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Jan 26 2009, 02:02 PM
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#4506
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Chatterbox Group: Resident Posts: 398 Joined: 10-March 08 From: Irving, Texas Member No.: 16,437 Gender : Male Name : Mark |
I look at it this way, who are we, as humans to judge. I have no authority to judge Matthew, just as I have no authority to judge President Obama. I have the authority to judge myself, and that is the only authority that I have to judge. You might disagree with someone, but you have no authority to tell them if they are or are not a Child of God. God is the ultimate Judge, and He will decide upon that.
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Jan 27 2009, 08:47 AM
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#4507
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Catching On Group: Newcomer Posts: 4 Joined: 26-January 09 From: Melbourne, Australia Member No.: 22,792 Gender : Male Name : Ben |
QUOTE (Matthew @ Jan 27 2009, 05:56 AM) The ultimate refutation is simple: I am a Christian and I have been one all my life, yet just the same I started having homosexual attractions at a young age. I thoroughly, prayerfully, researched this topic trusting the Spirit of Truth to lead me, and having faith that God would not abandon me to deceptive spirits. I now believe that homosexuality is acceptable... 1) Just because you've been Christian all you life does not mean sin cannot enter your life and yes, I believe that homosexuality is a sin. Just the same as if someone else was a christian all there life and the what I believe is the sin of prematerial sex enters their lives. 2) Can you back up your beliefs that homosexuality is acceptable in God's eyes with scripture? If you cannot back up your beliefs with scripture then I think you should pray, repent, and seek Jesus's forgiveness. |
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Jan 27 2009, 04:55 PM
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#4508
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Holy Roller Group: Resident Posts: 656 Joined: 26-December 06 From: Florida Member No.: 9,430 Gender : Male Name : Matthew |
QUOTE (V1p3R @ Jan 27 2009, 08:47 AM) 1) Just because you've been Christian all you life does not mean sin cannot enter your life and yes, homosexuality is a sin. Just the same as if someone else was a christian all there life and the sin of prematerial sex enters their lives. That wasn't the point. Point was: "Sin" came in, I fought "sin", asked God to lead me into Truth about "sin", put my trust and had faith in God to do so, and here I am. So either God is unfaithful and betrayed my trust, letting me be led astray, or what He's shown me is indeed true. Given the fruits of the Spirit and all the Good that has come of it, I pick the latter. QUOTE (V1p3R @ Jan 27 2009, 08:47 AM) 2) Can you back up your 'beliefs' that homosexuality is acceptable in God's eyes with scripture? If you cannot back up your beliefs with scripture then you must pray, repent, and seek Jesus's forgiveness. Yes, I can, but for the sake of not "breaking the rules" for debating, I'll let you do your own homework. |
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Jan 29 2009, 08:16 PM
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#4509
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Holy Roller Group: Resident Posts: 656 Joined: 26-December 06 From: Florida Member No.: 9,430 Gender : Male Name : Matthew |
QUOTE (SeN @ Jan 28 2009, 01:50 AM) The best you can claim that you are right now is a selective Bible-believing Christian. Repent! Turn back now. Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?' Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!' matthew 7:22-23 I believe in every part of the Bible. Interesting thing about that verse, is it applies to a whole lot of people in the Church today, but not so much who you’d expect. For a good study, find out what Jesus commanded, what the whole of the OT Law meant, how Jesus “fulfilled” the Law, and what sin is. Romans, Galatians, and I believe 1John are good places to start. May the Spirit lead you into all Truth.  |
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