Nano

Apparently not. Seems like a nice state to be in to me. More fair. So you agree that Genesis is not to be taken literally? God should remove them from existence when they die. Like-wise for everyone else. So your telling me that God is okay with rape, beating, torture, shooting, cutting off breast, sodomizing, murder, etc. as long as you believe and accept Jesus. Hm. .Thesaurus.com tells me symbolic is a synonym for allegorical and figurative. The snake is just one example, there are enough "little holes" in the story that should make it obvious the story is not to be taken literally. I hope this doesnt seem like im going off topic because really im trying to better understand why my orginal statement( If genesis is not literal, no need for jesus ) is false, but what was Jesus suppose to do again? From Sunday school i remember he went to hell and got everyones souls to bring to heaven? Is that true?

I'm sorry but if it was this easy there wouldnt be any atheist. The building blocks of life, amino acids, are made out of non-living elements( carbon, hydrogen, etc. ). Look at The Miller-Urey Experiement and more information under "Other eperiments" on that page. Again, no necessarily true. That is true for the laws of physics IN the universe we know, but who's to say that the laws of physics outside dont permit universes to just appear? Sure, it could have been God, but it could have been a lot of other things too. Keep your mind open to all ideas. Look at any argument from both sides.

You yourself said, .They do not have the knowledge between good and evil, so they can not know that what God says is good and what the serpent says is evil. God, being omniscient, should know this.God, knowing that his creations would eat from the tree anyway, acts surprised that they act from the tree and then punishes them and the snake. First off, snakes can not talk. It is generally believed that Satan was disguised as a snake right, and that is how it could speak. Why would god punish all snakes for what Satan did? It wasn't the snake's fault. I don't understand how you could see this as a literal story. (I know you don't Ronald, but i dont know why your defending creation.)

I believe in justice, mercy, and ethical subjectivism. Obviously i think its horrible what happened to those people and the four should be put in jail for a very long time, until they die perhaps, but nothing they do could be worth eternal damnation. I would a hope a merciful God could see that. Just curious, would those four people that you mentioned be saved if they accepted Jesus? OT: Would anyone deny this statement: If the Old Testament is figurative only and not literal, then there is no reason for Jesus to come in the New Testament.

Actually, i dont know i sin and neither do you. I am trying to declare there is a real option where sin never entered because i don't believe sin ever entered the world. I don't believe sin is an actual 'thing'. I dont remember reading anything in the bible that said this. I give my dog food and he doesnt do what i ask sometimes. I would think that is a good analogy since before eating the fruit Adam and Eve were ignorant like a dog. Exactly my point. How could God expect them to listen to Him if they were "mere toddlers"? If i put a cupcake infront of a toddler and told him not to eat it, i would expect him to eat it.

I dont understand how my logic is frayed. I remember you not taking the old testament to be credible with how ungod-like the god of the old testament is. If the Old Testament isnt credible then there was no literal fall of man and no point in Jesus.

First, a question for those you believe the creation story to be literal: How did God expect Adam and Eve to listen to him if they didn't know right from wrong? They could only know right from wrong AFTER eating from the tree. It makes no sense to tell people who have no understanding of right and wrong not to do something. Next, a question for those who dont believe the creation story to be literal: If the creation story is not literal and there was no adam or eve, then there couldnt have been original sin and so there would be no point of Jesus. How true is that sentence? just incase anyone cares im 14 raised in a highly catholic family and im now an atheist. Religion is an important thing in life so im just trying to reinforce my disbelief. That wasnt really worded well but w.e i think you understand what i mean.

To people saying we have no bodies then how will we get around? We will need eyes to see god, no? And also, if someone i knew was 80 when he died and in heaven he is 26, how will i recognize him? The whole concept of heaven seems very problematic to me.

I'm just wondering about the form you would be in if you get into heaven. I know none of you could know the answer unless there is some reading in the Bible, but i'de like to hear your opinions. Most people die when they are old, so are they in the same aged body in heaven? If a small child ( 5- 7 yrs old ) dies and gets into heaven is he still the same age? If an infant dies is he still the same age? If an amputee gets in is he still amputated? If a disabled person( paraplegic, autism, etc.. ) is he still disabled in heaven?

Sorry if this has already been discussed but I could'nt find anything about it in the search bar. The discussion in this thread is about this quote: "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able, and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" - Epicurus What is your response to this?

JAG, your analogy about a basketball player is nothing like what Talek is talking about. Basketball players choose to stop practicing basketball. Talek realized that there was no reason to believe in God. You don't really choose to believe. OT: If God and Hell exist, then according to the Bible you still go to Hell. [...]

...Okay i think i'm done with this thread. This will be my last post in this thread since im satisfied with the answer I've come to. But i'll leave you with this: If God knows that tomorrow I will buy a puppy, i will buy a puppy. Do i have a choice? No. If I did have a choice and i chose not to buy the puppy, then God would have been wrong, and that is not possible.

You just said God doesnt know something. According to the Bible, God knows everything. So clearly something is wrong here.

What don't you understand about God creating the timeline of the universe, and more importantly a timeline of your life? If a timeline exist then you dont have freewill. If God can see into the future, then a timeline MUST exist.

Alrighty, thanks for that i guess. Anyway, to answer the OP, Those numbers are true. And if you count the estimated total killings its Satan: 60, and God: over 25 million