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mintchocochip

Underage Sex

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If someone had sex with an underage person (16 or 18 depending on your state) and they had a commitment with them, for example, a "spiritual marriage" (not a legal one) would you consider that a sin?

By spiritual marriage I am going by the idea that marriage is not a legal institution, but a spiritual one, and God can join two people together without a binding legal agreement.

Would if be different if they both were underage or if only one was underage?

Discuss.

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If someone had sex with an underage person (16 or 18 depending on your state) and they had a commitment with them, for example, a "spiritual marriage" (not a legal one) would you consider that a sin?

By spiritual marriage I am going by the idea that marriage is not a legal institution, but a spiritual one, and God can join two people together without a binding legal agreement.

Would if be different if they both were underage or if only one was underage?

Discuss.

There is a difference between the question of 'should we do it' and 'can we do it'.

Can we do it:

It depends on two things.

1.Your definition of a 'spiritual' marriage.

2. Is it legal where you live? We are commanded to obey the law.

Should we do it:

You are instructed to be equally yoked. If the age discrepancy is too large, this could be effected. We are told by Paul to not desire to go get married. In fact he would prefer we stay single so we can focus on God, instead of our partner. He does say, however, if your purity is at stake, you should get married.

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If someone had sex with an underage person (16 or 18 depending on your state) and they had a commitment with them, for example, a "spiritual marriage" (not a legal one) would you consider that a sin?

By spiritual marriage I am going by the idea that marriage is not a legal institution, but a spiritual one, and God can join two people together without a binding legal agreement.

Would if be different if they both were underage or if only one was underage?

Discuss.

Agreed with previous poster. We should follow the laws of the land. Legal marriage is possible with parental consent, so I would see no need to go outside of legal bounds.

God binds two people spiritually. The law binds them legally.

In the case you were on a deserted island with a girl, I'm sure that if you made a covenant with God and with her, He would recognize it.

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I am generally against sex only being legal with those 18+ just because of how it's screwed people over. If it's consensual, it's wrong that an 18 year would be marked as a sex offender for the rest of their life for sleeping with their 17 year old significant other. That's not to say I support people having underage sex, it's just that the law should not be the thing that ruins it.

If they are married (real marriage, purely spiritual not government marriage) then this is not a sin. In fact, I would even go so far as saying it's a sin to have just a legal marriage. It's putting the government in place of love and God.

Jay

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I'm Catholic, so Sacraments play a large deal in how I view things. My views lead me to believe that there is no spiritual marriage without a ceremony preformed by a properly ordained minister (unless it's physically impossible to get to a church/have a priest perform a ceremony. Like deserted island or something like that), and considering the Church will not marry people in normal society without legal documentation, then this is a pretty moot question.

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In all honesty, I think its very wrong for people to be having sex under the age of 18/19/20. It doesn't seem natural at all.

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Just how young are we talking? If they're old enough to enter into the marriage covenant, they're old enough...

In the case you were on a deserted island with a girl, I'm sure that if you made a covenant with God and with her, He would recognize it.

Well, forum says mintchocochip is female, and assuming mintchocochip is telling the truth, I'm not sure I agree with same-sex marriage... :>

But, assuming you meant "on a deserted island with the opposite sex", I don't understand why you'd want to have sex with them. You're either going to get rescued, in which case you can wait, or not, in which case you will live the rest of your lives on the island. With no contraception, so you're probably going to end up with children. Who are then going to live their - single - lives on the island, because they'll be no one for them to marry... except their siblings, which would probably result in your grandchildren dying a painful death from a genetic disorder...

:P :p :P

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Can we do it:

It depends on two things.

1.Your definition of a 'spiritual' marriage.

2. Is it legal where you live? We are commanded to obey the law.

This answers it perfectly. The Word of God is complete.

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In all honesty, I think its very wrong for people to be having sex under the age of 18/19/20. It doesn't seem natural at all.

No offense, but that's the prime age for reproduction. During Biblical times and even in very conservative places today, sex as soon as you hit puberty is very common. As soon as you're able to reproduce, your sexual instincts emerge so it does make sense for people having it "under the age of 18/19/20."

Sex and especially procreation is pretty gross at any age, however.

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As far as I know, Sex outside of marriage is not holy in God's eye whether you are underage or overage. Sex must be done after Marriage :D

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You are married when you make your vows before GOD (and typically people), in accordance to whatever laws are applicable in your state, country or jurisdiction. Once you have done that, you are married.

"Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband." - 1 Cor 7:1-2

“Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.” - Hebrews 13:4

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I don't think that God put an age for sex in the Bible but there is a legal age- yes

With that spiritual marriage idea i don't think any thing is wrong with that but that doesn't say the two people should have sex

# 1 ITS ILLEGAL :shock:

# 2 God did say that sex should be done after marriage and not before meaning if they are not legally married how can they ( god would let two people get 'spiritually married and be o.k. with them having sex knowing that the older would be committing a crime and soon arrested breaking up the whole idea of spiritual 'MARRIAGE')

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Just how young are we talking? If they're old enough to enter into the marriage covenant, they're old enough...

Well, forum says mintchocochip is female, and assuming mintchocochip is telling the truth, I'm not sure I agree with same-sex marriage... :>

But, assuming you meant "on a deserted island with the opposite sex", I don't understand why you'd want to have sex with them. You're either going to get rescued, in which case you can wait, or not, in which case you will live the rest of your lives on the island. With no contraception, so you're probably going to end up with children. Who are then going to live their - single - lives on the island, because they'll be no one for them to marry... except their siblings, which would probably result in your grandchildren dying a painful death from a genetic disorder...

:P :p :P

Though at this rate what if you were the last two people on Earth..... there would be massive inbreeding and a genetic bottleneck effect but thats the cost of humans being repopulated.

Don't bring up same/sex marriage that isn't the intent of the thread.... there are people here with different views on that and we don't need another debate drawing from a lovely topic.

I feel that in this society some people aren't ready for sex at the young age, while others may be.... so it depends on them and the state of their union. While it may be ok/not ok in God's eyes it is important to also look at the mental/emotional age of the ones in question for some of us age quicker and others slower.

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I don't believe there is a such thing as spiritual marriage.

Look in the OT at the role the Father played in giving the wife, and society in recognising it, including government (c.f the need for the certificate of divorce). That same has remained true today.

Marriage has a public accountability - "spiritual marriage" is a square circle. So, sex in its context would be sex outside of marriage.

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Marriage has a public accountability - "spiritual marriage" is a square circle. So, sex in its context would be sex outside of marriage.
Interesting question, then: can you get married if you live on a deserted island?

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This debate seems to have turned into what counts as marriage.

What makes two people married varies by time and place. In our country you need a license and vows are the icing on the cake. Without a wedding license you're not married in the USA. The Bible commands us to obey the law of the land (unless the law requires us to sin). So, I don't believe that spiritual marriage is marriage. If you don't want to do a big wedding. Just get a marriage license and go to your pastor and say your vows or even say vows with your close family and friends, it's not that hard.

Of course in that extremely rare scenario that you're stuck on an uninhabited island (whether dessert, tropical, or whatever climate). Then saying vows and promising each for life would count as marriage. And you're not disobeying the law of the land about marriage, because there isn't any. If say it's two sixteen year olds I don't see it as a moral problem for them to get married on the uninhabited island. But making such a big decision and becoming sexually active (especially without contraception) isn't the wisest decision. Well, getting married and becoming sexually active on an uninhabited island without contraception is a bad idea at any after age puberty and before menopause. I mean having a ton of kids and no resources to raise them or education to give them.

In other cultures and in past time periods different things counted as marriage. Arrangements with livestock or money, or becoming part of your husband's or wife's (depending on the culture) kin, or simply going into your husband's tent. And there were and are many other things that count as marriage in different times and to different cultures. But those things don't count as marriage for now (in most of the world). And saying vows and singing a license didn't count as marriage then (or in some parts of the world).

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I am generally against sex only being legal with those 18+ just because of how it's screwed people over. If it's consensual, it's wrong that an 18 year would be marked as a sex offender for the rest of their life for sleeping with their 17 year old significant other. That's not to say I support people having underage sex, it's just that the law should not be the thing that ruins it.

I feel like these kind of cases rarely get reported, and when they do, they are protected by Romeo & Juliet laws (reduces or eliminates punishment for people when one person is 18-19 and the other is 14-17. Basically, it's common sense.) IMO, two (unmarried) teens being stupid or careless in their sexual decisions, although clearly against God's law, shouldn't get the same punishment as more serious sexual crimes. An 18-year-old having sex with his 15-year-old girlfriend is a lot different than a 40-year-old raping a 12-year-old or saving sexual pictures of 8-year-olds on their computer.

God asks us to obey the laws. Simple as that. And besides that, although I'm okay with people getting married young (depending on the sitch), I see no rhyme or reason as to why 16-17 year olds need to get married. Or even have sex, but that kinda happens all the time.

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If they are not married, i would say its a sin. If they are married and only one of them is under age, yes, it'd be a sin (to a degree)...

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Interesting question, then: can you get married if you live on a deserted island?

At that point, I'd say you become the governing authority. If they were standard, with no chance to return home anytime, I'd say they can marry. If we think about it, say four generations later from two people and there'd certainly be the need.

But, we're here dealing with the norm, that is that you live in a populated country, where components of government, family, a more sizeable society are all present.

And, simple Biblical wisdom dictates that there ought not be marriage without some authorisation by a governing authority - stressing that we are dealing with the norm for countries - that they are populated.

"Then, someone may ask, why not take government of the marriage equation and leave it up to individual worshiping communities to decide whom they will marry and what constitutes marriage? Even if our politicians were entertaining such a notion (which they’re not), it would be utterly impossible and completely undesirable. No-marriage is worse than messed-up-marriage. From taxes to estates to child custody, the state has a vested interest in overseeing the legality of marriage. They will not give that up, and it would be an unholy mess if they did. Imagine the chaos if every church or synagogue or mosque handled marriage on its own. Eight people playing cards every Friday would call themselves a church, ordain someone as a minister, and start doing marriages on the side. Hormonal teens with a conscience about sex before marriage would quickly get married one night so they would no longer have to “burn with passion.” Child custody would often be a nightmare. Divorce would be easier than ever. Everything that marriage is supposed to protect and promote would be undermined. We need some institution that is nationally recognized and has the means to enforce its own laws? Whether we like it or not, that institution in the modern world is the state." - Kevin De Young.

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