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Modesty?

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Modesty has been kinda going round my mind a lot recently (I think they call that conviction). Here's what I've got going on at the moment:

 

Christians are called to be in the world but not of the world. There's something counter-cultural about covering up, in a society that places so much emphasis on the exposure of the image. How we look plays a role in being set apart; whilst Christians aren't to judge based on appearances, the world certainly does. Rejecting the notion that everything should be revealed is daring, to say the least. 

 

The fact that dressing modestly helps men with lust is a positive thing, but it should not be the primary motivation. Modest dress is commanded by God. Women should dress modestly even when there is no risk of inciting lust; men should not lust even when women are dressed scantily (and vice versa). Modesty is about obedience to Godand therefore, it's as much about modesty of the heart as it is about modesty of dress. 

 

None of the above means I think anyone should be shamed, judged, harassed, attacked, or anything else, for what they wear. But, it's how I feel about it. 

 

I guess, in short, my rules for modesty are:

- is it appropriate?

- can I move freely in it?

- does it make clear my feminine identity?

- does it set me apart from the world?

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Modesty has been kinda going round my mind a lot recently (I think they call that conviction). Here's what I've got going on at the moment:

 

Christians are called to be in the world but not of the world. There's something counter-cultural about covering up, in a society that places so much emphasis on the exposure of the image. How we look plays a role in being set apart; whilst Christians aren't to judge based on appearances, the world certainly does. Rejecting the notion that everything should be revealed is daring, to say the least. 

 

The fact that dressing modestly helps men with lust is a positive thing, but it should not be the primary motivation. Modest dress is commanded by God. Women should dress modestly even when there is no risk of inciting lust; men should not lust even when women are dressed scantily (and vice versa). Modesty is about obedience to Godand therefore, it's as much about modesty of the heart as it is about modesty of dress. 

 

None of the above means I think anyone should be shamed, judged, harassed, attacked, or anything else, for what they wear. But, it's how I feel about it. 

 

I guess, in short, my rules for modesty are:

- is it appropriate?

- can I move freely in it?

- does it make clear my feminine identity?

- does it set me apart from the world?

Me likely, and we're not even usually on the same side of issues connected with gender debates.

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Me likely, and we're not even usually on the same side of issues connected with gender debates.

 

Oh man, you and I need to chat about some changes that have been occurring :P 

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For this topic, I would like to offer the thoughts of William F. Buckley, a seminal writer and luminary in the modern conservative movement, and (of course) a devout Roman Catholic:

 

Edited by Chris-M

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For this topic, I would like to offer the thoughts of William F. Buckley, a seminal writer and luminary in the modern conservative movement, and (of course) a devout Roman Catholic:

 

 

 

Ha ha :lol:

 

That's hilarious!

Edited by GODS_NOT_DEAD

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Oh, just wanted to throw this out there Mode-sty.com is a sort of modest clothing site that has flash sales now and then. You can sign up with email and follow their blog to get modest fashion deals and inspiration. Another site that has modest clothing that isn't always granny-ish is Modcloth. They're sort of on the "alternative" clothing side. Downtown Demure is also Modest fashion and Christian lifestyle blog.

SheIn looks like a cool online shop too. For all your sakes, I'm just gonna list a whole load I fashion sites that I've found across the internet that have some modest fashion choices:

http://www.cupshe.com/

http://morninglavender.com/

http://www.humblechic.com/

That's all I have for now, I'll list some more later! :)

Edited by ECAlvarez

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People should dress modestly because it may attract unwanted attention.For example, if we all went to church naked people will be sexually aroused by others. So, people would be distracted by worshipping God and they could commit adultery or even worse lose virginity. That's why people should be modest kn their dressing. I'm sure most girls will disagree saying I "We can be able to wear what we want without judgement." I'm a guy and when any girl waks past in tight fitting clothing I do look. Every guy looks it's common. I'm not sure how some girls may look at guys.

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People should dress modestly because it may attract unwanted attention.For example, if we all went to church naked people will be sexually aroused by others. people would be distracted by worshipping God and they could commit adultery or even worse lose virginity. That's why people should be modest kn their dressing. I'm sure most girls will disagree saying I "We can be able to wear what we want without judgement." I'm a guy and when any girl waks past in tight fitting clothing I do look. Every guy looks it's common. I'm not sure how some girls may look at guys. "

How is having sex with someone else's spouse/partner not as bad as losing ones virginity? What the heck, dude. XD your logic just... nah man, nah.

God said "the man shall be with his wife and the two become one flesh." That's losing ones virginity. To their spouse. In the context of marraige, God's down with it. 

If we all went to church naked, we'd be part of one those societies that doesn't hardcore sexualize everything. Think the people from national goegraphic who walk around topless like it's nobody's business. Culture has a play into modesty, some cultures are nonchalant when it comes to the topic. America alternates between "Sexualiz everything!" and "No, sex is gross, hide it, shield your eyes, young ones!" 


"Modest" is such a broad term and has been thrown around so much that I've begun to hate the word. 

I wear what I want because I know that if a man wants to look, he's going to look no matter what. -shrug- I've been creeped on in baggy shirts and pants and ignored in leggings. I've had the opposite happen. No matter what, men are going to stare.And quite honestly, it's on their conscience at this point, not mine. 

My manner of dress goes "Is it comfy?" (I double dog dare you booty shorts wearers to look me in the eye and tell me those things are comfortable as you awkwardly yank them down from your pelvic region...) 

And then it comes down to a heart check. "am I wearing this because I like it, or because I solely want to attract attention to my body?"  If it's the latter, that's not being modest. Modesty is more so a thing of the heart than of the body. We dress to express ourselves and if our manner of dress is all "ME ME ME ME LOOK AT MEI'M SO SEXY" That is a pride thing, a heart issue. Modesty goes hand in hand with being humble. Sure, express yourself, but there's a difference between "This is cute and quirky" and "Let's see how much attention from the opposite sex I can gather." 

As for guys, don't tell me to be modest when ya'll run around shirtless at public pools and beaches. >_> We look too and some of us have very active imaginations. It's a two way street, don't tell women to cover up when you yourself run around half dressed. 

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 People should dress modestly because it may attract unwanted attention.For example, if we all went to church naked people will be sexually aroused by others. people would be distracted by worshipping God and they could commit adultery or even worse lose virginity. That's why people should be modest kn their dressing. I'm sure most girls will disagree saying I "We can be able to wear what we want without judgement." I'm a guy and when any girl waks past in tight fitting clothing I do look. Every guy looks it's common. I'm not sure how some girls may look at guys. "

How is having sex with someone else's spouse/partner not as bad as losing ones virginity? What the heck, dude. XD your logic just... nah man, nah.God said "the man shall be with his wife and the two become one flesh." That's losing ones virginity. To their spouse. In the context of marraige, God's down with it. If we all went to church naked, we'd be part of one those societies that doesn't hardcore sexualize everything. Think the people from national goegraphic who walk around topless like it's nobody's business. Culture has a play into modesty, some cultures are nonchalant when it comes to the topic. America alternates between "Sexualiz everything!" and "No, sex is gross, hide it, shield your eyes, young ones!" "Modest" is such a broad term and has been thrown around so much that I've begun to hate the word. I wear what I want because I know that if a man wants to look, he's going to look no matter what. -shrug- I've been creeped on in baggy shirts and pants and ignored in leggings. I've had the opposite happen. No matter what, men are going to stare.And quite honestly, it's on their conscience at this point, not mine. My manner of dress goes "Is it comfy?" (I double dog dare you booty shorts wearers to look me in the eye and tell me those things are comfortable as you awkwardly yank them down from your pelvic region...) And then it comes down to a heart check. "am I wearing this because I like it, or because I solely want to attract attention to my body?"  If it's the latter, that's not being modest. Modesty is more so a thing of the heart than of the body. We dress to express ourselves and if our manner of dress is all "ME ME ME ME LOOK AT MEI'M SO SEXY" That is a pride thing, a heart issue. Modesty goes hand in hand with being humble. Sure, express yourself, but there's a difference between "This is cute and quirky" and "Let's see how much attention from the opposite sex I can gather." As for guys, don't tell me to be modest when ya'll run around shirtless at public pools and beaches. >_> We look too and some of us have very active imaginations. It's a two way street, don't tell women to cover up when you yourself run around half dressed.

This is lovely. Thank you.

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As for guys, don't tell me to be modest when ya'll run around shirtless at public pools and beaches. >_> We look too and some of us have very active imaginations. It's a two way street, don't tell women to cover up when you yourself run around half dressed. 

 

 

My shirtlessness on the beach is about as arousing as the fish skeleton I'd be running past.

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While I think that modesty is a social standard, (which is going to the wayside), I think there is another aspect to it. My opinion is that your wearing something just to get people to pay attention to you or your body, that is immodest. Some might say that it all depends on whats comfortable for the person and thats the clothing is not about getting attention. That idea is just absurd. You see women wearing shorty shorts when its -20 degrees outside and tight pants that looked like they took an hour to put on. You tell me if that is comfortable.

  And us guys aren't out of the woods yet. Wearing body hugging t-shirts to show off your "guns" and "abs" to the ladies. That is just as immodest.

 

 I do believe that clothing that is sensible to the situation is fine, even if it is a bit revealing. Such as a guy being shirtless when its hot or they're working and both guys and gals wearing shorts.

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I sa a post and it made a lot of sense. Wouldn't it make more sense to teach boys to keep them eyes to themselves rather then lusting after a girl. Also, wouldn't the the person looking at the girl be at fault and not the girl? Cause she's expressing how she wants to dress to the beach or school?

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I sa a post and it made a lot of sense. Wouldn't it make more sense to teach boys to keep them eyes to themselves rather then lusting after a girl. Also, wouldn't the the person looking at the girl be at fault and not the girl? Cause she's expressing how she wants to dress to the beach or school?

Well, often times they dress that way to get all the attention. Our society is so enameled on the person's physical looks, so people wear clothes that accentuate their body to gain that acceptance. 

 

Her "expression" is often just a cash-grab to try to fit the societal standard.

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I'm never going to condemn others for the way they dress. I sometimes dress modest and sometimes I go to the beach too, but this year I have been very focused on being modest on Sundays: Long sleeved high collar tops, and either long loose-fitting pants, or ankle-length maxi skirts. Not just for church, but the whole Sunday. I've even been covering my hair since February. I haven't made a lifelong commitment or anything. It just has been something I started doing and have taken it one Sunday at a time.

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Well, often times they dress that way to get all the attention. Our society is so enameled on the person's physical looks, so people wear clothes that accentuate their body to gain that acceptance. 

 

Her "expression" is often just a cash-grab to try to fit the societal standard.

I missed the part where that was your problem?

Bryce (actually) made a decent point. It's not the individual's fault that some people don't bother to have any self control. 

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 My opinion is that your wearing something just to get people to pay attention to you or your body, that is immodest. 

 

 

Someone wears a T-shirt with a Pokemon on it, hoping that someone who likes Pokemon will hosey on up and say "Whoah, cool t-shirt!"  And that's supposed to be immodest?  It's normal and good to want positive attention and to use clothes to get that. The modesty debate is about to what extent if any sexualized fashion is inappropriate. That's it.

 

On that topic, my thoughts are as follows:

 

On the one hand, there was a time when women couldn't wear pants because a very patriarchal society had decided that those were "too sexy." That's dumb. It's good that we've gotten past that. On the other hand, I'm leery of the idea that the individual should just get to do "whatever" without social consequences because trying to pretend like we can just all becomes sexless bots who turn sexual urges on and off at will is silly. Sexualization happens, no matter who's in power, and we regulate sexualized states of dress for good reasons.

Edited by Chris-M

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Bryce (actually) made a decent point. It's not the individual's fault that some people don't bother to have any self control.

Yup

Reminds me of a story from an article I read

I once attended a Southern California church that asked women to stop wearing tank tops in the summer in order to, "help their brothers out." Apparently the males of the church found lady parts (in this case, exposed arm skin) distracting. Instead of focusing on strengthening the men of their congregation, the leadership asked the women of the church to get sweaty and uncomfortable for the benefit of these ridiculously weak-willed boys.

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My idea of modesty would be to cover yourself to the point of appropriateness but to show your figure a bit. 

 

I'd say appropriateness would be wearing a dress that goes with  your figure but not like hug it. which i'd say is inappropriate because it reveals to much of you.

Inappropriate- would be showing cleavage, i think its better to cover that area. 

 

Inappropriate- would be wearing tights or leggings that are to tight

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Modesty doesn't just go for girls....Guys need to be modest too.....Its not just Girls not wearing tight short things....when guys go around shirtless...yes it is attracting girls attention....but girls shouldn't be staring at guys and lusting over them,

 

I agree with this 100%. We put a lot of emphasis on girls being modest (and we should, I teach my middle school girls about this in Sunday School). But guys can be immodest too. I think our attitudes can be modest or immodest. If we wear dresses but walk around pridefully that isn't being modest.

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I am very much into modesty. I don't think shortie shorts should be sold. And I think women should wear a dress or skirt to church... And not the length the teen girls at my church wear, which is super short. I think you should at least go JUST above the knee. I can hardly find a modest dress in the stores, they are all so short! Even in the girls section, it is crazy how short they make dresses for little girls... So I buy my stuff from Mikarose, modest brand :D

 

That is so true. It doesn't get any easier when you're in high school either...

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I feel like no one ever talks about modesty anymore? for girls and guys? What does everyone thing is modest for a girl or guy to wear? In my opinion.

I agree that modesty has been declining, and yeah, it sucks as a Christian. I think modest means don't let your underwear show (usually guys do this) and don't wear low-cut shirts if you're a girl. Well, for guys low-cut shirts are often immodest as well. Yes, disciplining yourself or your children to keep your eyes to yourself is good, but in no way does that excuse immodest clothing. If a girl wears booty shorts and a tank top, she's gonna get looked at.

But still, it's like arianna said on page 1, "nothing compares to the modesty within which is humbleness, sincerity, and a loving and caring heart for the Lord." If you love the Lord, you will follow His commandments and He says to wear clothes that cover stuff!

Edited by Bladesinger

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idk a specific verse off the top of my head but ive never heard anything otherwise? treat your body like a temple.

 

actually i just looked up a verse I thought of but couldn't remember the location: (it's 1 Peter 3:3-4) "Do not let your adorning be external - the braiding of hair and the putting on of gold jewelry, or the clothing you wear - but let your adorning be the hidden person of the heart with the imperishable beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which in God's sight is very precious."

 

and 1 Timothy 2:9 "Likewise also that women should adorn themselves in respectable apparel, with modesty and self-control, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly attire."

 

Where does it say that it's okay not to?

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idk a specific verse off the top of my head but ive never heard anything otherwise? treat your body like a temple.

 

actually i just looked up a verse I thought of but couldn't remember the location: (it's 1 Peter 3:3-4) "Do not let your adorning be external - the braiding of hair and the putting on of gold jewelry, or the clothing you wear - but let your adorning be the hidden person of the heart with the imperishable beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit, which in God's sight is very precious."

 

and 1 Timothy 2:9 "Likewise also that women should adorn themselves in respectable apparel, with modesty and self-control, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly attire."

 

Where does it say that it's okay not to?

Great, good to know I was a skanky seven year old with my braided pigtails and gold necklace. 

:P 

See Arab women in their veils? That's Biblical modesty. Culturally, that is how they dressed. There was no talk or jeans or shorts. They didn't wear t-shirts or v-necks. 

I've said it before and I'll say it again, to the point of feeling like a broken record:

Your clothing choices reflect your soul.  They are the outward expression of the inward. If the inward is lacking maturity, Christlikeness, or something else, it'll show in the manner of dress.

Do you crave attention? You probably wear bright flashy things and tend to show more skin.

Are you covered in logos and swooshes? you're probably into sports.

Are you more feminine? you may wear more skirts or dresses than pants.

Do you want respect? You probably dress nicely, perhaps a little nicer than others around you.

Are you a Becky? Help yourself to the moon boots and jeggings, you wonderful weirdo.

Are you emo? Well, I'm not sure what your soul needs but Emo kinda died in 2011 so I'm not sure why you haven't moved on to hipster yet... but hey, you do you! 

Modesty is not a clothing issue, it's a soul issue.  People are always griping about clothes, too much clothes, too little clothes, blah blah blah. 

An old MercyMe song says "God's gotta change her heart before He changes her shirt." People are so quick to call someone "immodest" and write them off as hopeless without seeing the soul inside that needs a little more love or maybe just doesn't know any better! 

If your conscience (or mom) isn't screaming at you to change clothes, your reproductive organs are covered well (no moose knuckles or camel toe!) it doesn't look like body paint, isn't transparent and you can move comfortably, you're probably modest.  

I've noticed that everyone's modesty and comfort level is a little different. some feel naked in less than a turtleneck shirt, some feel prudish in more than regular shorts. 

If you feel convicted, change. If you don't and think you maybe should, talk to someone. 

....I read the section  name wrong. I thought this was highschool. wow... my bad yo.

Edited by Boogles

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